Barrique

[Juznjak]

Barrique bacve od hrasta su bilo, nase, francuske ili neke druge poprilicno skupe i - ogranicenog zivotnog vjeka kao barrique svojstvo. Dakle dva tri vina i barrique nije vise barrique vec bacva od barrique-a moze posluziti samo kao spremnik za vino ili ocat.
Da bi se dao novi zivot barrique bacvama, inox i inim spremnicima francuzi su pronasli alternativna rjesenja. Ucinili su duzice, plocice, kuglice, kockice,chips, granulat, ... razno razne sitne oblike visoko kvalitetnog hrasta te ih visestupnjevito opalili i ponudili trzistu. Aroma da je divota.
Da li vi stovani forumasi i forumasice imate nekih spozanaja, ustvari osobnih iskustava ili ste culi nesto o tome od onih koji su ta alternativna sredstva vec koristili? To kao i svaka druga stvar ima svojih dobrih i svojih manje dobrih osobina.

[Juznjak]

Pozorno sam procitao cijeli ovaj forum vezano za alternativu barrique-u. Neke stvari su mi zapale u oko a to je da cesto spominjete "chips" medjutim neznam da li je to zbog toga da bi oblatili ta alternativna sredstva ili niste culi i za drugo odnosno nije dostupno na HR trzistu.
Zanimao sam se u Francuskoj i vidio da su oni i tu alternativu barrique-u izdigli na pijedestal na nacin kako to oni rade sa svime sto je vezano za lozu ili vino.
Nekoliko zakonitosti koji vrijede sada u Francuskoj su medju ostalim da se barrique bacva (FR hrast, USA hrast ili neki iz Istocne Europe citaj Rumunjske) upotrebljava 3 godine. Ima vinara koji za neka svoja vina barrique bacvu upotrebljavaju samo jednom i potom je prodaju. Bacva poslije 3 vina moze se kupiti za od 60 do 90-tak € za razliku od nove koja kosta od 450 do 800 €.
Vino u hrastovoj bacvi prodire u stijenke oko 2 do 3 mm godisnje. Ako nakon treceg vina bacva u FR odlazi na remont kod bacvara skida se 8 do 9 mm iznutra i ponovno opali.
Francuzi proizvode dakle osim tog "famoznog" cipsa i slijedece:
- ravne dugice od prvoklasnog hrasta 95 cm x 5 cm x 2.2 cm koje su slojevito opaljene sa svih strana  i istih su svojstava kao i dugice na barrique bacvi a preporucaju za crna vina "Zinfandel" drzati ga u inox bacvi 4 do 6 mjeseci (uz redovito probavanje);
- plocice od tih dugica koje su istih svojstava kao i gore navedene dugice;
- kuglice promjera 2 cm istih svojstava i po izboru stupnja opaljenosti koje se stavljaju u 'ofucalu' bacvu nakon tri vina;
- kockice 1cmx1cmx1cm takodjer opaljene u vise sstupnjeva opaljenosti;
- treset nepravilnog sitnijed oblika koji se stavlja u kesice kao za caj samo sto su duge recimo metar i pol (slice na crijevo)te se takve spuste u inoxicu ili u ishlapjelu ex bacvu barrique;
- granulat koji se takodjer stavlja u te duguljaste vrecice.

Kao sto ste mogli vidjeti postoji siroka lepeza tih proizvoda a u Francuskoj je pracena svjedodzbama i razno raznim certifikatima.
Ako vas zanima mozda bi mogli negdje koncem studenog ili pocetkom Prosinca upriliciti i neku demonstraciju tih proizvoda u HR? Vjerujem da bi Francuzi rado dosli pokazati sto imaju i cime se ponose.

[Razor]

Mislim da definitivno ova tema zaslužuje više pažnje.
Pišite!

[gabro]

Mislim da definitivno ova tema zaslužuje više pažnje.
Pišite!

Tema JE stvarno zanimljiva,i znate šta sam primjetio ovdje dole su stvarno bogom dana vina za tkz.barik proizvodnju i šta se događa sad svi hoče radit barik vina i onda dobiješ vino koje je pretjerano oplemenjeno barik aromom da vino nema nikakvog okusa osim hrastovine,zato bih molio da što više iskustava čujemo ovdje da bi se to promijenilo!

Opet je najveći problem N E Z N A NJ E  I  N E I S K U S T V O  !!!!!

[Juznjak]

Hrast je plemenito drvo za razliku os smokve, bora, tresnje i dr te se podesenim zagrijavanjem prodire po dubini i pobudjuju medju ostalim atomaticna svojstva sirokog spektra. Sada se to radi i indukcijskim zagrijavanjem, sve dugice & ostali komadi(ci) drva se kompjuterski kontroliraju tijekom zagrijavanja i obiljezavaju brojem tako da ukoliko 'pogodite' svome vinu barrique tim i tim oblikom barrique alternative/zagrijavanja onda nema frke za to ponoviti i naredne godine.
Proizvodjaci barrique alternative imaju svoje enologe koji su spremni dati najbolji savjet za vino koje im donesete na kusanje. Oni govore o oprezu. Savjetuju da se cesto probava ono sto se u inoxici 'kuha' sa barrique alternativom ili da se u manjem sudu ucini nesto poput koncentrata sto bi se pomijesalo sa ostalim vinom i dobilo tocno ono sto se zeli. Oni daju i tocno mjeru recimo koliko dugica staviti u inoxicu na 100 l da bi se dobilo za 4 do 6 mjeseci vino kao da je bilo cijelo vrijeme u novoj barrique bacvi. Francuzi kazu da je to revolucija u njegovanju vina te da vino koje se drzi u hrastovoj bacvi poslije 4 godine vise nista od te bacve ne dobiva osim bolesti ukoliko bacva nije zdrava.

[Diabolic]

No Wood No Good. Perhaps, but what type of wood are we talking about?

Ever noticed how oak barrels are always so conspicuous in cellar door outlets. Perhaps it's because barrels represent tradition, quality and patience in the eyes of the wine tasting public. Barrels are hand made by master craftsmen and women from a complex natural product using time-honoured methods. As such they represent a romantic ideal of wine culture.

But most of the wines that people consume in Australia have never seen an oak barrel. Cleverly worded marketing references to "oak flavour" and "oak character" on back labels seems to imply that they do. However, if the word "barrel" is not specifically mentioned on the label then chances are, the wine's oak character has been imparted using one of a myriad of non barrel oaking methods. These alternative methods include oak chips, oak powder, or by the insertion of oak staves into tank.

Before I go into detail as to how these non-barrel oak alternatives work, I must stress that there is nothing sinister or misleading about them. With the price of quality French (225 litre) barriques nudging $AUS1000, the cold hard economic facts are that you cannot age wine in them and sell it with a sub $AUS12 price tag. So for wines at this price point, a cheaper oak alternative is the only answer. As a comparison, oak character can be imparted using oak chips for only a few cents per bottle, compared with around $AUS3-4 if a French barrique is used.

The most common oak alternative is oak chips. They are added at various stages of the winemaking process, either thrown straight into the ferment or are later dipped into the wine tank after being placed into big "onion bags". Oak chips come in a variety of different types, varying in their forest of origin, in their size, the amount they are toasted, and whether they have been water pre-soaked. All these factors impact on wine character. Toasting chips gives them a smoky, bacon and caramel character. Due to their greater surface area, smaller chips give more character per unit weight added, and water pre-soaked chips are lower in astringent tannins. So for the winemaker there are lots of choices even with chips.

The use of oak powder is less common than chipping, although they are a very practical alternative if oak character is to be introduced during fermentation (a timing which many winemakers prefer as they feel that better oak integration is achieved if the character is introduced early). Recently I was fortunate to taste two versions of a despicably herbaceous Napa Merlot. One was unoaked and the other had been fermented in the presence of oak powder. To my surprise there was very little oak character present in the powdered wine, but even more surprisingly was a clear reduction in the level of the wine's herbaceousness. The improvement was not a figment of my imagination as I found out later that the amount of organosulfur compounds contained in the wine, (which contribute to its herbal character) was reduced by "powdering" the wine.

Wines can also gain oak character by inserting oak planks or staves into tank. Two variations of the method exist. Either longer planks are held vertically or shorter staves are stacked in a log cabin fashion at the bottom of the tank. These systems are cost effective and yield good results in terms of quality as the wine undergoes temperature controlled fermentation in tank in the presence of oak, achieving acceptable oak and fruit integration. The method is also practical as once sufficient oak character has been imparted, the planks can be lifted out, dried and used again.

So what's the catch? Most seasoned wine tasters would agree that wines aged in oak barrels are usually better than those which have had oak character imparted to them using alternatives. It is much harder to achieve seamless fruit and oak integration using alternative methods of oaking than with barrel. Chipping and powdering can also produce a brown paper bag like flavour due to extraction of the celluloses from the wood, whilst tank staves may produce more obvious bacon and smoky aromas. So why are barrels superior given that the wine is in contact with oak no matter what method is used? The answer lies in not so much in the chemical nature of the oak itself but in the fact that a barrel is unique in that it allows controlled amounts of oxygen in and out of the wine over a long period of time. Oxygen reacts with wine components, both modifying, and in most cases improving its flavour and mouth-feel. Alternative oaking methods are now being used in conjunction with a recently developed process called micro-oxygenation. Micro-ox is a high tech process of adding small, accurately measured amounts of oxygen to a wine over a period of time. The chips provide the oak flavour and the micro-ox process improves the mouth-feel. Scary eh …but if you want to continue drinking good quality sub $12 wine …..

[Diabolic]

Are Chips a Good, Cheap Option?
How container type, chip shape and contact time affect the amount of oak compounds released into the wine.
by Bibiana Guerra


Editor's Note: This article is part of a semi-regular series of research briefs sponsored by the Department of Viticulture and Enology at UC Davis. For more summaries of research sponsored by UC Davis Department of Viticulture and Enology.

If you are a winemakerconcerned with the price of new barrels, you have probably wondered what type of wood provides the best oak aroma for your wine. These authors wondered, too, and published the results of their trial in "The use of oak chips during the ageing of a red wine in stainless steel tanks or used barrels: effect of the contact time and size of the oak chips on aroma compounds" in the Australian Journal of Grape and Wine Research, 14:63-70, 2008. Since the title says it all, let's move right into the trial lay-out and the results.

Trial Lay-out

The authors used a 2004 Monastrell (Mourvedre) wine from D.O. Jumilla, Spain, which had completed alcoholic and malolactic fermentations. They put this wine in stainless steel tanks (1,000 liters) by itself, in the presence of cubes (2.4 g/L), in the presence of shavings (2.6 g/L) or in the presence of powder (1.3 g/L). Rates were calculated to simulate the surface/volume of a barrel. They also put the same wine in used barrels, once again, by itself, with cubes, with shavings or with powder. These used barrels--American oak--had been used seven times and had followed a sulfur burning sanitation regime. Finally, the authors put the wine in new barrels--medium toast--from the same cooperage as the used barrels. All of the chips used--cubes, shavings and powder--were also medium toast.

To assess the influence of contact time, the different treatments were allowed to stay in the wine for either three, six or nine months. Because wine normally undergoes a period of anaerobic ageing in the bottle after oak ageing, the authors mimicked that by waiting for another six months after bottling before taking any measurements. All treatments were conducted in triplicate (three tanks, three used barrels and three new barrels for each type of chip and contact time). At the end of the experiment, the authors studied how container type, chip shape and contact time length had affected the amount of oak compounds released into the wines.

Background

But first, let's review the main categories of compounds that wood can bestow to a wine. There are five categories of interest to us: lactones, furfurals, vanillin, guaiacols and ethylphenols.

The overall, oversimplified picture would be something like this. At the beginning, raw oak contributes mainly lactones. As the wood is toasted, the lactones diminish and furfural and vanillin increase. At even higher toast levels, these compounds are gradually replaced by guaiacol. In the meantime, if yeast is present--and chances are there will be some embedded in the wood--their microbial activity will contribute ethylphenols. [Even though the current authors do not study it, there is a sixth class of wood compounds--eugenol and isoeugenol--present in raw wood; however, they increase with toasting, which imparts a spicy, clove aroma.] The authors then studied the impact of container, chip shape and contact time on each of these compounds.

Furfurals

Furfural and methylfurfural contribute a pleasant aroma to the wine (sweet, butterscotch, light caramel, light almond). They form during the toasting process as a result of the degradation by heat of the carbohydrates in the wood (cellulose and hemicellulose)--a process called Maillard reaction.

After just three months, furfural--and methylfurfural--were high in the wines to which oak chips had been added. Used barrels plus chips showed higher levels than tanks plus chips. Cubes were more effective than shavings or powder in increasing furfural. Interestingly, the authors found that furfural levels decreased after six and nine months of contact, rather than the other way around. This is because furfurals, which are aldehydes, tend to be converted in time into their respective alcohols. Therefore, for longer periods of time, conversion exceeds extraction, and furfural levels go down.

But the highest furfural levels of all the treatments compared were those of the new barrels. Even though furfural levels tended to decrease after bottling in all treatments, the wines that had been aged in new barrels were still the ones showing the largest concentrations.


Guaiacols

Guaiacol and methylguaiacol impart smoky, char and spicy aromas to the wine; guaiacol is more smoky whereas methylguaiacol is more spicy. They are formed by the degradation of wood lignin due to very high temperatures--a process called pyrolysis.

The authors found very low levels of these compounds in both tanks and barrels. This agrees with reports that guaiacol formation is low when toasting temperatures are below 446°F (230°C).

Lactones

Lactones in either of their two isomers--cis and trans--are the main compounds released by wood from a sensory point of view. They impart a fresh oak and coconut aroma to the wine. Cis-lactone has more of a wood character; trans-lactone is more herbaceous.

In tanks without chips, no lactones were detected--proof of its oak origin. With chips, the authors found more lactones when cubes or shavings were used than when they used powder. This also confirms that lactones were in the wood before toasting; otherwise, more would have been found in the smaller formats.

One of the most remarkable features about lactones was that their extraction was very fast, with levels after three months being similar to those with six and nine months. This effect was exacerbated by the use of chips. Whereas with chips, lactones were very high at the beginning and later decreased when wine was aged in new barrels, lactones continued to increase. In other words, the release of oak lactones is much faster with chips than with barrels. This makes sense since more time is expected for a wine to penetrate a stave barrel--and then for the compounds to permeate back into the wine--than to penetrate a chip.

Ethylphenols

The animal, leather, horsy, sweaty aromas that we are so familiar with are attributed to 4-ethylphenols (and sometimes also 4-ethylguaiacol). These compounds are not naturally present in the wood. As we know, they are formed by Brettanomyces and other yeasts when they decarboxylate the phenolic acids present in the wood (coumaric acid and ferulic acid). Therefore, the amount of these compounds in wines aged in wood is going to depend on the presence of their precursors--and on the amount of yeast. As a reminder, yeast have been found as deep as 8 mm (3 inches) within the wood staves of a used barrel.

The authors found the very lowest levels of ethylphenols after three months, both in the wine that had been in tanks--with or without chips--and in the wine that had been in barrels--used or new, with or without chips. In contrast, the highest levels of ethylphenols were found after six and nine months of ageing. In other words, time had more impact than type of container. For longer periods of ageing, the authors found higher levels of ethylphenols with cubes than with the other types of chips.

Surprisingly, ethylphenol levels were high even in the control wine (tank without chips) after six months. The authors believe that a previous Brettanomyces contamination from the winery led to this increase in ethylphenols. Thus, Brett--and ethylphenols--were likely present in this Mourvedre wine from the start. The authors commented how this is an increasing problem in wineries that are adopting the trend of not stabilizing their wines, something that makes them more nutritionally attractive to Brettanomyces.

Overall, ethylphenol levels were slightly higher in those wines that had been aged in barrels compared with those that had been aged in tanks. After six months of ageing in the bottle, the authors detected no changes in ethylphenols. Apparently, it had no chance to increase in the anaerobic conditions of the bottle.

Vanillin

Vanillin, the main aroma compound in natural vanilla beans, is also present in raw oak. Vanillin increases with medium toast levels but decreases with very high toast. Vanillin can also be transformed into non-aromatic vanillyl alcohols by yeast.

Similarly to ethylphenols, the authors found vanillin in the control wines, meaning vanillin can form by mechanisms other than wood extraction.

The highest vanillin levels were found after three months of contact with chips, particularly when cubes were used. Because finer pieces of wood are more combustible, higher vanillin is expected to form. However, when size is too small (<5mm), losses due to evaporation have been reported.

For longer contact times, vanillin levels in wine treated with chips decreased and in wine kept in new barrels increased. As we mentioned before, as wine matures, vanillin changes into non-aromatic compounds. Unlike what happened with chips, from which vanillin was released and quickly converted, when the wine was in new barrels, prolonged extraction was able to exceed conversion and the result was vanillin accumulation. As was also the case with lactones, new barrels provide a slower, more sustained release of vanillin.

Conclusions

Using sophisticated analyses, the authors tried to organize the large amount of data developed from the various container/oak additive combinations tested. They were able to reach the following conclusions:

1. The type of container and the contact time were the parameters leading to the most significant differences in the aromatic profile of the wines. The shape of the chips was much less important.

2. Wines with new barrels could be totally separated (by discriminant analysis) from those with chips added. Similarly, wines aged for three months were very different from those aged for six or nine months.

3. Chips released aroma compounds into the wine very rapidly while new barrels kept extracting aroma compounds for longer periods. Used barrels with added chips had a behavior somewhere in between.

Based on the above results, the authors consider that oak chips are a good cost-effective way of ageing wine in a short time while reusing used barrels, but that "overall wine quality is better in wines matured in new barrels." wbm

[apostol]

Evo kao novi član da se javim.

Mislim da će jako teško bit simulirat barrique bačvu pomoću chipseva i drugog jer bačva dijelom propušta tj. ima vezu sa zrakom i kao takva je teško zamjenjiva. Chipsevi su jako dobri kod fermentacije crnih vina gdje se dodaju u masulj i mogu dati vrlo zanimljive rezultate.
Ako se već radi s takvim trijeskama, chipsevima.... svakako je bolje dodavati ih u iskorištenu barrique bačvu.

[Dražen]

@Diabolic, a prijevod?

Are Chips a Good, Cheap Option?
How container type, chip shape and contact time affect the amount of oak compounds released into the wine.
by Bibiana Guerra
....

[gogo_2009]

@Diabolic, a prijevod?

Za nuždu može ovako http://translate.google.hr/translate?hl=hr&sl=en&u=http://www.winebusiness.com/wbm/%3Fgo%3DgetArticle%26dataId%3D64492&ei=_GHITOPfHM7rOfqO1O8I&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBcQ7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3DHow%2Bcontainer%2Btype,%2Bchip%2Bshape%2Band%2Bcontact%2Btime%2Baffect%2Bthe%2Bamount%2Bof%2Boak%2Bcompounds%2Breleased%2Binto%2Bthe%2Bwine.%2Bby%2BBibiana%2BGuerra%26hl%3Dhr%26biw%3D1408%26bih%3D704%26prmd%3Do

nije baš u duhu hrvatskog jezika ali ako otprilike znaš o čemu je riječ može poslužiti 

[vali]

koji je najpovoljniji trenutak da se stavi cips u vino.pozdrav.